tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19150297.post7056877144740007745..comments2023-07-04T10:30:14.276-04:00Comments on Intrepid Liberal Journal: Tell theTruth: Are You A Liar?Robert Ellmanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03526287813354418269noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19150297.post-45607881576294599732007-05-02T01:11:00.000-04:002007-05-02T01:11:00.000-04:00I think you're right there Rob, few have the coura...I think you're right there Rob, few have the courage to stand up. I guess I was just going more philosophical and wondering if maybe somehow the system we have set up churns on these liars, or causes them to rise to the top.<BR/><BR/>I think certainly with politicians all over TV and other such mass media Americans put a premium on likability and charisma, which sometimes goes hand-in-hand with dishonesty and moral weakness.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19150297.post-21428763428109175342007-04-30T21:05:00.000-04:002007-04-30T21:05:00.000-04:00Hi J-ro -I would say any and all of the above. Par...Hi J-ro -<BR/><BR/>I would say any and all of the above. Partly it's because Americans want Champagne for the price of beer. Hence, politicians are forced to lie to some extent just to appease our want everything without paying for it mentality.<BR/><BR/>Also, as you suggest the system itself. Upinvermont makes incisive points that few politicians are statesman. And there is simple human fraility.<BR/><BR/>I realize lying is part of the game but when these folks lie about war and peace and global warming the people have to stand up and demand truth. Some of these lies cost lives.Robert Ellmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03526287813354418269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19150297.post-44031792256691264342007-04-29T22:39:00.000-04:002007-04-29T22:39:00.000-04:00Nice thoughts Rob. I've got a question for you. Th...Nice thoughts Rob. I've got a question for you. The fact that politicians lie isn't in dispute. But why do politicians lie? Is the system built in such a way that only liars rise to the top? Do we, as a voting public, put so much pressure on our leaders to be right and live in dangerous times that they are pressured into lying? Do the American people demand a liar President? Or do the American people just consistantly elect dishonest people?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19150297.post-14248779222253067692007-04-29T12:17:00.000-04:002007-04-29T12:17:00.000-04:00Wonderful essay, Rob. 'Twas by first visit to you...Wonderful essay, Rob. 'Twas by first visit to your blog, so I'm sure to be back. Happen to be reading Eric Alterman's delicious "When Presidents Lie" now, so your piece was a special treat.Trivia Masterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07262070715095059080noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19150297.post-91127727186707471762007-04-28T12:43:00.000-04:002007-04-28T12:43:00.000-04:00Hi Rob,Your Dad is almost right.Everyone famously ...Hi Rob,<BR/><BR/>Your Dad is almost right.<BR/><BR/>Everyone famously thinks they are above average but in nearly every aspect of culture, conformity rather than originality is considered the hallmark of intelligence. Originality, though it may eventually be recognized, nearly always exacts a high price. Socrates and Jesus were both murdered for their originality.<BR/><BR/>Any number of *original* artists, composers, writers, poets, scientists were vilified or ignored in their own day. Mozart was far less successful than his less original contemporaries.<BR/><BR/>Politics, more so than most avocations, seems to be a meritocracy of the banal & insipid The qualities that are necessary for a man or woman to be elected are not necessarily the qualities needed for good governance.<BR/><BR/>To make a loose analogy, politicians are like any run-of-the-mill pop icon, they have a good voice, good hair but few of them could write their own music. Pop icons are the ultimate embodiment of conformity. Their music is written for them and is deliberately made to appeal to the least common denominator (and therefore the widest audience) -- making the music shallow, venal, insipid and wildly popular. Pop music, rather than trying to develop new ideas, seeks to exploit whatever is current and faddish. Once that particular cultural moment is gone, the music fades with it.<BR/><BR/>The Bush administration is the Milli Vanilli of its day. Rove finds his direct parallel in Frank Farian and Bush is Rab Morvan and Rob Pilatus wrapped into one person. Rove would understand my analogy to the very roots of his expedient little soul. <BR/><BR/>Unfortunately, when venal and banal men govern, then corruption, lying, equivocation, and expediency are almost inevitably the result. These are the traits of banality.<BR/><BR/>Every politician in power, literally, has won a popularity contest which is little different than a Miss America pageant. A few have won for the right reasons. Most have not. Bernie Sanders is an example of someone who, in my opinion, is in office for the right reasons. He doesn't say what's popular, he's an independent (a Socialist!), and he knows how many tits are on a cow. He doesn't whore himself out to lobbyists.<BR/><BR/>Great politicians who are also great statesmen, are few and far between - possibly once every generation. I think that almost everyone would agree that Lincoln falls into this category.<BR/><BR/>Those were different times though, before the age of TV and sound-bites. I don't know if Lincoln could be elected these days, but maybe.<BR/><BR/>I don't think there is a solution. If everyone is above average, then everyone is average. I suspect that most politicians, in terms of governance, are below average.<BR/><BR/>Their skills were in winning the beauty contest, not in managing the show. Their skills were in singing the songs, not writing them.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com